Listening Closely with Lorna Dune

Welcome back to AND THE SUN, a newsletter about creative, artistic, and inventive approaches to meditation. Thanks for tuning in again.

🎹

This week we feature multi-talented musician, composer, and sound & experience designer, named Lorna Dune. We’ll jump right in, but first:

I’m hosting another attachment & meditation workshop with Evan Leed. It’s a two-hour workshop on a Saturday afternoon where we’ll use meditation to introduce you to the ideas and experiences of secure attachment. You can sign up here.

An Interview with Lorna Dune

Avery: Your workspace is full of interesting lights and gadgets! I imagine that’s part of your creative process?

Lorna: I’m currently in my studio in Milwaukee. It’s my little lab for working on music and audio—I have a vocal booth, a vibroacoustic meditation chair, and tech I experiment with. I also have Hue lights to create different atmospheres. Sometimes I set the lights based on my mood. Lighting and sound together are essential in setting a space, especially for creating music.

Avery: That sounds amazing! Do you use color to influence your creative or emotional state?

Lorna: Absolutely. Color plays a huge role in shaping the energy of the room. I use lights that reflect the energy I want to bring into a session. My usual go-to colors are pink and teal, but they change throughout the day. Color and sound together set a vibe. It’s like circadian lighting with a creative twist.

Avery: What excites me about your work is how it blends the sensory world with creativity—how you see experience itself as a medium, and the tools to work with that could be anything sensory.

Lorna: As artists, it’s all about exploration and experience. The tools we have today are great, but we’re also reconnecting with ancient, sacred practices like sound and color therapy. I’m especially excited about how art, sound, and sensory experiences can be applied not just for art’s sake but for health, therapy, and other fields. We’re at an exciting point where these ancient tools are merging with modern technology to explore new possibilities in healing and communal spaces.

Ivan: Have you faced challenges in translating your personal experience into something broadly appealing and accessible to the masses?

Lorna: It can be a challenge, especially when you're working in fields like TV or advertising where you’re trying to evoke specific responses from sound. Instrument selection, harmonies, and even frequency ranges play a role in how people perceive music. For instance, if I use a trombone, one person might have a strong negative reaction based on personal or cultural associations. I love working with electronic music because it’s more abstract. You’re not dealing with as much baggage—it's all about creating new, imaginative sounds that can be more open and atmospheric. 

Avery: So, you feel that people have fewer associations with electronic sounds than with traditional instruments?

Lorna: Absolutely. Traditional instruments carry a lot of cultural and emotional associations, but electronic sounds are more abstract. Our brains are constantly scanning for patterns, and electronic sounds are less likely to trigger familiar associations. This makes them more flexible for creating new emotional landscapes.

Avery: A lot of your work focuses on meditation. How do you approach designing sound for meditation?

Lorna: The type of meditation affects the sound design that goes into it. If it’s Zen meditation, I use more natural, environmental sounds to create a serene space. For compassion meditation, I might lean into major harmonies to evoke heart-opening feelings. Low-end frequencies in sound baths create a more immersive experience. So it’s about aligning sound with the aim of the meditation—whether to deepen the practice or subtly guide the participant without overwhelming them.

Avery: Do you think there’s a difference between background and foreground music in meditation?

Lorna: Absolutely. In some cases, music is meant to be in the background, like Brian Eno’s concept of discrete music, where it subtly affects you without being the focus. But background music is still impactful—it shapes your environment. In the video game world, we call it "BGM" or background music, and it can have a huge effect on the experience. The key is understanding how much the sound should lead versus how much it should support.

Ivan: As someone who’s studied music theory, do you think the connection between music and the body is intuitive, or something you’ve had to figure out through experimentation?

Lorna: It’s a mix. There’s an intuitive aspect, especially when it comes to your personal experience with music, but there’s also a lot of trial and error. I reflect on the music that moves me and break it down—frequency, timbre, rhythm—then experiment with how different sounds affect emotional and somatic responses. There are tools like spectrographs that let you see the frequency spectrum of sounds around you. I think hands-on production work is key for anyone looking to understand sound on a deeper level—learning how different elements interact with each other and how they interact with your own body.

Avery: You just sparked an idea. Imagine an art installation where trained meditation guides help people engage with music or other parts of the art based on where they’re at—helping someone settle if they’re distracted, or guiding them deeper if they’re already calm. It’s like combining teaching with the installation.

Lorna: That’s an interesting idea! I love the concept of discovery and curiosity as part of the experience. Just interacting with an installation—moving and seeing how it affects the visuals or sound—can trigger a sense of wonder. Having a guide would definitely enhance the experience for people, especially those new to meditation or deep listening. At the end of the day, sound is powerful because it doesn’t always need instructions. It can pull you inward naturally, especially with something like a gong or a drum that envelops you without guidance. Sound interacts with our nervous system in such a primal way.

Ivan: Speaking of meaningful interaction, how do you design an installation or product that moves beyond novelty and stays meaningful after that initial excitement wears off?

Lorna: That’s a big challenge. Novelty is exciting, but it fades. What keeps people coming back is how deeply they connect with the experience. For instance, in a project called Sensie Sonic Labs, founded by Mike Dannheim and audio-programmed by Max Maksutovic, we used sensors in a phone to create mindful movement. I did the sound and instrument design. The phone responds to Tai Chi-like motions with sound frequencies designed to be healing. The idea was that through play and movement, people would naturally find stillness. It’s about designing an experience that starts with exploration but gently guides people toward a deeper state. 

Avery: I love how you’re thinking about guiding users. It’s not just about novelty but about creating an experience that helps people find calm and stillness.

Lorna: Exactly. And with technology like EEG sensors, we’re starting to track how people respond to different stimuli more precisely. We can design sound and light patterns that target specific brainwave states, helping people drop into deeper relaxation or focus. But I also think it’s important not to rely too heavily on technology. There are natural ways to experience biofeedback, like calling into a cave and hearing your voice echo back. Technology is great, but it’s not always necessary either.

Avery: That’s a great point. Technology can help train our nervous systems or teach new skills, but we shouldn’t become dependent on it. It can create peak, meaningful moments, but ideally, the lessons integrate into our lives without needing the tech constantly.

Lorna: Exactly. Good design can merge art and technology to create experiences that are meaningful in the moment and help foster long-term practice. For example, I’m working with a company called SoundSelf that uses sound, light, and vibration to guide users into meditative states. SoundSelf started as an art installation at Burning Man, meant to be a communal experience. Over time, it evolved into a personal product and is now being used in ketamine clinics. It’s interesting to see how something that begins as art can develop into a tool for long-term healing.

Avery: That’s a really good point. It’s not about separating meaning from practice but letting design and intention carry both. You’ve been an artist most of your life, but at some point, you shifted to seeing things through a product lens. How do you balance your artistic impulses with more product-based thinking?

Lorna: That’s a great question. I don’t think the artistic and product sides are as different as they seem. There’s a growing recognition of the potential to use artistic expression in structured ways as tools for therapy and other applications. Sometimes products for healing or wellness get watered down for mass appeal, but I believe in staying true to the artistic vision. When I work on something like SoundSelf or even sound design for film or TV, the artistic side is what makes it resonate. Even something as simple as Netflix’s “dun dun”—there’s so much thought behind those two notes. They convey a brand’s identity in such a specific way.

Avery: Do you have any final thoughts or advice for people exploring this space?

Lorna: Stay curious and open. Whether you’re working with sound, light, or other sensory input, there’s so much potential to create meaningful experiences. Don’t be afraid to take risks, and remember the human experience behind the technology. It’s all about connecting with people, whether through a sound, a color, or a vibration. Keep experimenting, and don’t lose sight of that human connection.

Meditation Soundscape

This is a sound meditation for “loving-kindness” practice, also referred to as metta. It is split into three stages: Presencing, Deeping, and Returning. The track is meant to support a yoga Savasana, and can also be used on its own to support a meditation practice of your choosing.

See how the sound moves you into different states from tension to relaxation to introspection and perhaps silence. By the end, you might feel refreshed and at ease, having settled from the listening experience.

🎶

The music featured is currently being used in SoundSelf. The sampled instruments were part of a yoga training series called Sound Ceremony.

To wrap up this week’s newsletter, check out Lorna’s newest ambient electronic album…

🌞